6.5td instead of 454tbi

[BurbanAZ]

ive noticed on our latest trips our biggest issue is the range we get before having to stop for gas, and if were way out its just annoying always having to keep that in mind. I have a 92 k2500 suburban with a 454tbi and a 4l80e, i was thinking of swapping a 6.5 td in place of the 454. Ive heard its not super involved as far as engine swaps go. I was thinking of looking at the government auctions and trying to find one with low miles pretty cheap. Any idea of what id be able to squeeze out of a 6.5 for mpg? Im getting like 7-8 now with my 454 and that's being light on throttle and braking, its just killing me on long trips. Also would a 6.5 td be a better choice than a 6.5 naturally aspirated or a 6.2? i still want the same towing ability that i have now, but if i could squeeze out close to 20 mpg that would make a huge difference.

[Sub-Par]

A turbo 6.2 (NA 6.2, 6.5T components bolt on) may be a better start. The 6.2 motor is considerable cheaper and easier to find, and has a few tougher components than the 6.5, like the pistons. You could re use your 4L80 I'm sure with an adapter, and with a free flowing exhaust you probably could see around 13-17 mpg in mixed driving. The earlier 6.2 engines can be found new in crate military surplus for around $895 (long block ony). Long run, you would be time and money ahead to just buy a stock 6.5 'Burb though.

[Koots]

A healthy 6.5 or 6.2 turbo setup should get you 13-16MPG for sure.

You will lose some towing performance, but you should be able to handle the same weight. You should do better at higher altitudes as well, due to it being forced induction.

[croak51]

its really a shame you dont wanna do anything extensive id say throw a cummins 6bt and a 5 speed and call her good but hey just my 2 cents

[Avec]

My k2500 6.5 Sub gets 15-16 all day long. Running clean (no trailer, no roof load) and empty, I have gotten just a tick under 20 on a 475 mile highway run. I have 3.73 gears, and the sweet spot for me is about 1800 rpm, which is right around 70MPH. After that, mileage starts to drop fast. It takes a lot to push that brick through the air. Couple that with a 43 gallon fuel tank, and there is more range than you will want to do in a day. As for the swap, getting a complete vehicle is a good idea. You will need to swap out basically all electrical behind the dash.

[Koots]

Even with my little 31 gallon K5 tank, i still get over 500miles on a tank, running 35's.

With my new power additions, i expect to see a little hit in MPG, along with the drop to a TH350...but i hope to be able to drive competitively in highway traffic, instead of being the unofficial "Pace Car" of wherever i'm going :crazy:

Either way, you should be able to get better mileage than the 454 in all driving conditions. Even heavy hauling with hardly stock 6.5TD's, people report getting 12-14 while towing.

[helo]

You'll need a new torque converter for a diesel motor.

The surplus crate/"new" 6.2's are the hot ticket if you spot one. They auction the CUCVs that don't start instead of repairing, so the spare parts sit unused. Clean 80's trucks get listed because of a dead battery (2012!).

Be wary of the government 6.5's, some may look clean in the pictures but usually there is a serious problem that prevents them from wanting to do an overhaul (engine overhaul is really good "training"). They typically just re-assemble the block after inspection, put it in a crate and send pictures to DRMO.

My 2c, have you considered a 350 (or even a 383)? I knock down 14-17 in my '89 with [ec3] 4l80e + 5.7 vortec-tbi (daily commuting on dirt roads & small mountains). My highway range is beyond how long I want to go without a break. It's no cummins/dmax, but a roller cam 350 is cheap/reliable.

[BurbanAZ]

yea seems kinda risky with the government stuff, kinda hard to tell what ur getting. Ill probably just keep my truck the way it is and keep enjoying it, try and cleaning up the engine in there now and see if i can get a few more mpg out of it. Even if i could get to like 12 id be happy.

[Koots]

If you havent done so already, try changing your transmission filter (and a shift kit if you can afford it) and the t-case and diff fluids. An expensive switch to synthetic gear oil in my diffs made for a much smoother rolling vehicle in my K5. I havent driven it much since the fluid change to gauge mileage but i felt a noticeable difference in smoothness.

Id also go for the ol' tune-up stuff like plugs, wires, cap/rotor, air and fuel filter, injector clean, seafoam (or water) through the brake booster vacuum lines, etc.

It also doesnt hurt to Get an alignment, change O2 sensors, replace cat (or gut the bastard) and many other things.

[BurbanAZ]

If you havent done so already, try changing your transmission filter (and a shift kit if you can afford it) and the t-case and diff fluids. An expensive switch to synthetic gear oil in my diffs made for a much smoother rolling vehicle in my K5. I havent driven it much since the fluid change to gauge mileage but i felt a noticeable difference in smoothness.

Id also go for the ol' tune-up stuff like plugs, wires, cap/rotor, air and fuel filter, injector clean, seafoam (or water) through the brake booster vacuum lines, etc.

It also doesnt hurt to Get an alignment, change O2 sensors, replace cat (or gut the bastard) and many other things.

I havent done too much, i did do the normal tune up stuff though, new plugs/ wires, dist. changed diff fluids, tranny fluid/ filter. I have a good size crack in one of my exhaust manifolds so im thinking that may be hurting me, and im thinking the cat may be clogged so im going to replace that also.

[1988 GMC 355]

Get some longtubes and a new y pipe that is mandrel bent and new high flow cat(s) to replace the clogged one and enjoy some more power and MPG. You can add a TB spacer and the ultimate TBI mods to to help along with opening up the factory air intake.

[BurbanAZ]

Get some longtubes and a new y pipe that is mandrel bent and new high flow cat(s) to replace the clogged one and enjoy some more power and MPG. You can add a TB spacer and the ultimate TBI mods to to help along with opening up the factory air intake.
any longtubes that ud reccomend?

[helo]

Man, I still think the bottom line is you've got a 454 and no matter what you do, your mileage & range is always going to be in the dirt. I doubt you['ll ever see 12mpg mixed, just the nature of the beast-- IT'S A 454.

I'm sure you can get some decent $$$$ for a running 454tbi on craigslist; drag racers are all about those blocks (especially if they can come test drive it). Going to a 350 isn't much work at all, and I'm sure it will extend your range by hundreds of miles without sacrificing tow ability. The 4l80e and 4-core radiator are the crucial components for towing.

[Koots]

If you are gonna change the motor out, i would swap to a 6.5TD or a 6.2TD. You get better towing than a SBC, while pulling better MPG than either SBC or BBC while towing. Even my N/A 6.2 can out-tow any SBC of it's era. Might take me longer to get there, but it can handle the load better in city/low speed driving.

It wouldn't be an issue to see 14MPG while towing upwards of 8000lbs. It definitely isn't unheard of. If you're gonna spend the money on buying a turbo setup, skip the GM turbo's and go with one from any year of 5.9L cummins. They all share the same flange and will only require minor mods and you get more towing prowess.

There are some guys i know running a 6.5TD, with an HE351VGT turbo from the newer 5.9/6.7L, 18:1 compression motor and they put it all in a C5500 dump truck and use it for their business to haul equipment and soil. I don't know what their mileage was but i know they were happy with it and it's performance:


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=buB_VNLIdaM

and they are currently driving around in a recently rebuilt 6.2L with custom fire-ringed block and have fully used up all the fuel the stock mechanical pumps can offer. They are also planning a 300HP custom build now with a custom IP, filling in the block and it shouldn't take them much longer to finish that.

[BurbanAZ]

If you are gonna change the motor out, i would swap to a 6.5TD or a 6.2TD. You get better towing than a SBC, while pulling better MPG than either SBC or BBC while towing. Even my N/A 6.2 can out-tow any SBC of it's era. Might take me longer to get there, but it can handle the load better in city/low speed driving.

It wouldn't be an issue to see 14MPG while towing upwards of 8000lbs. It definitely isn't unheard of. If you're gonna spend the money on buying a turbo setup, skip the GM turbo's and go with one from any year of 5.9L cummins. They all share the same flange and will only require minor mods and you get more towing prowess.

There are some guys i know running a 6.5TD, with an HE351VGT turbo from the newer 5.9/6.7L, 18:1 compression motor and they put it all in a C5500 dump truck and use it for their business to haul equipment and soil. I don't know what their mileage was but i know they were happy with it and it's performance:


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=buB_VNLIdaM

and they are currently driving around in a recently rebuilt 6.2L with custom fire-ringed block and have fully used up all the fuel the stock mechanical pumps can offer. They are also planning a 300HP custom build now with a custom IP, filling in the block and it shouldn't take them much longer to finish that.

Yea i wouldn't want to go back to a sbc just because when i had it, it was fine but i like the power of the 454 way more and i love the low end torque. Do you think swapping a 6.5td would be the same level of difficulty as swapping a sbc in? From what ive read the radiator mine currently has with the 454 and tow package is the same as the 6.2/6.5 and the 4l80e is the same except for the torque converter. I also read they share the same mounts and the bell housing will bolt up. Is that wrong?

[1988 GMC 355]

any longtubes that ud reccomend?

Hookers for sure.

[redchevy914x4]

Swap in a 12v and be done with it

[Koots]

Yea i wouldn't want to go back to a sbc just because when i had it, it was fine but i like the power of the 454 way more and i love the low end torque. Do you think swapping a 6.5td would be the same level of difficulty as swapping a sbc in? From what ive read the radiator mine currently has with the 454 and tow package is the same as the 6.2/6.5 and the 4l80e is the same except for the torque converter. I also read they share the same mounts and the bell housing will bolt up. Is that wrong?

The 6.5TD will be harder than swapping in a SBC but if you are going to swap motors, you might as work a little bit more to swpa the diesel. It ould require a new fuel tank/fuel pickup, new lift pump, run new fuel lines, might require new engine mounts as the 6.5 uses SBC mounts IIRC. if you are swapping to a mechanical diesel (which highly recommend) then your wiring will be minimal, you might be better off going with a 93-95 donor truck, keeping the OBD-I controls and should hook up to factory wiring as close as possible. Im not as fond of the computer controlled 6.5TDs but they do have coated pistons, bigger injection pump with more control over the fueling, better heads, etc.

A donor truck shouldnt cost very much in that age range, plus you can grab any small part you need. I recommend changing the injectors and glow plugs with the engine out of the vehicle. If you want dependability, swap in a rebuilt IP as well and you should be ready to go anywhere. If the truck runs fine and has good power, then the IP might not need replacement...but its nice insurance.

Anyway, a healthy stock 6.5TD would be behind a 454 when towing, but not by a whole lot. These need a 4" diamond eye exhaust, 3" downpipe and mandrel bent crossover pipe and a good tune to be competitive with a healthy 454 but they will. Throw an H1C, HX35, or other cummins turbo on the truck and you will give most any BBC truck a good run for its money. While still getting double digit mileage (might dip to the single digits if you are hard on it).




Swap in a 12v and be done with it

[BurbanAZ]

yea if im going to go through the work of a swap i would rather just swap in a diesel. Im going to keep an eye out for a donor truck, im trying to get ahold of this guy right now http://tucson.craigslist.org/cto/2758527499.html

[Koots]

BTW, apparently the 88-2000 (OBS) body style uses the same engine mounts for 6.5 and 454. So you have one less thing to worry about.

That truck in the ad should be perfect. Just make sure it runs and starts fine. Make sure there isn't much smoke, a little is okay if it's a cold start. Once it starts warming up it should not smoke at all during idle. A little grey/white smoke could be bad injectors, Bad IP. low cylinder temps or "burning" coolant. If it's black/grey than it's probably running too rich or you have a restriction somewhere.

Save your money up for a nice H1C, HX35 or HX40II turbo (there are some chinese knock-offs floating around that are cheap and seem to be holding up according to the net). These should all give you better performance than your 454, with better mileage.

[BurbanAZ]

the guys not responding to me emails, ill still keep an eye open and even drive a ways if i need to to find a donor truck. Thanks for all the help koots.

[Koots]

I recommend looking for a nice truck nearby that might be for sale, that is in good running condition and take it out for a test drive. Get a feel for how these trucks run, because it will be totally different than your gasser...if you are not used to driving a diesel vehicle...especially an older IDI diesel like the 6.2/6.5 that won't make giant power numbers stock like the modern diesels.

If you are satisfied with a stock or nearly stock truck, then a modified and tuned truck will work great for you...at a fraction of a 6BT swap IMO

[BurbanAZ]

I recommend looking for a nice truck nearby that might be for sale, that is in good running condition and take it out for a test drive. Get a feel for how these trucks run, because it will be totally different than your gasser...if you are not used to driving a diesel vehicle...especially an older IDI diesel like the 6.2/6.5 that won't make giant power numbers stock like the modern diesels.

If you are satisfied with a stock or nearly stock truck, then a modified and tuned truck will work great for you...at a fraction of a 6BT swap IMO

i have only driven a few diesel and really liked them. The only diesel i drive on a regular basis is a 60,000 lb ladder truck on the fire department, but thats a different animal lol. Im not worried about crazy power numbers either, just decent mileage, without loosing to much tq. I drove a 6.2 diesel suburban for a friend when he was looking to buy it and asking my opinion and really liked it.

[1998454]

With a 350 he will not extend his fuel range by hundreds of miles...And going from a 454 to a 350 without sacrificing towing ability is hilarious...If that were true, the light duty trucks would have 454's and the heavier trucks would get a 350.
Man, I still think the bottom line is you've got a 454 and no matter what you do, your mileage & range is always going to be in the dirt. I doubt you['ll ever see 12mpg mixed, just the nature of the beast-- IT'S A 454.

I'm sure you can get some decent $$$$ for a running 454tbi on craigslist; drag racers are all about those blocks (especially if they can come test drive it). Going to a 350 isn't much work at all, and I'm sure it will extend your range by hundreds of miles without sacrificing tow ability. The 4l80e and 4-core radiator are the crucial components for towing.

[Koots]

i have only driven a few diesel and really liked them. The only diesel i drive on a regular basis is a 60,000 lb ladder truck on the fire department, but thats a different animal lol. Im not worried about crazy power numbers either, just decent mileage, without loosing to much tq. I drove a 6.2 diesel suburban for a friend when he was looking to buy it and asking my opinion and really liked it.

The 6.5TDs have many extra benefits over the naturally aspirated 6.2s., so if you liked the 6.2, then dont worry about trying them out first.

[M.A.V.]

Have you considered doing a vortec 454? I'm running 35's on mine, and I pull about 10 around town easy on it, and on the highway I get about 12. When I first bought it, I put on a set of 265 bfg's and I was pulling about 14 on the highway and 12 in town, but I also have a CAI and true duals. I don't know about arizona, but here in Idaho salvage yards are filled with 96+ obs's with vortec motors, I'm sure if I looked hard enough I could find one local if I ever needed a new one. My buddy bought a 95 with the 454tbi and on average with his 35's and 6" lift, he was pulling about 6, while I was pulling 10, and I had a lot more power than his 95. Maybe just put vortec componants on your 454, be cheaper and easier than swapping the whole motor and you'll definitely gain a few mpg and power.

The only thing I wanted from the TBI was the lope the motor had, both of us had 40 series and his just sounded a lot meaner than mine even though we both knew I could outrun him without trying.

If you'd want to, before doing the swap to see what I mean, go to a dealership and test drive a truck with the 454 vortec and compare the differences, I know you can't really tell mpg on a test drive but you'll see the power difference I'm talking about. I test drove a couple 454 tbi trucks before I test drove my suburban, and as soon as I stepped on the gas I was sold.

[BurbanAZ]

Have you considered doing a vortec 454? I'm running 35's on mine, and I pull about 10 around town easy on it, and on the highway I get about 12. When I first bought it, I put on a set of 265 bfg's and I was pulling about 14 on the highway and 12 in town, but I also have a CAI and true duals. I don't know about arizona, but here in Idaho salvage yards are filled with 96+ obs's with vortec motors, I'm sure if I looked hard enough I could find one local if I ever needed a new one. My buddy bought a 95 with the 454tbi and on average with his 35's and 6" lift, he was pulling about 6, while I was pulling 10, and I had a lot more power than his 95. Maybe just put vortec componants on your 454, be cheaper and easier than swapping the whole motor and you'll definitely gain a few mpg and power.

The only thing I wanted from the TBI was the lope the motor had, both of us had 40 series and his just sounded a lot meaner than mine even though we both knew I could outrun him without trying.

If you'd want to, before doing the swap to see what I mean, go to a dealership and test drive a truck with the 454 vortec and compare the differences, I know you can't really tell mpg on a test drive but you'll see the power difference I'm talking about. I test drove a couple 454 tbi trucks before I test drove my suburban, and as soon as I stepped on the gas I was sold.

ill have to look into what vortec components i could put on my engine now, i dont know a whole lot about the vortec systems since ive always had tbi on both the suburbans ive had. I do like the simplicity of the tbi but if i could get a few more mpg and some more power out of going with vortec parts it would seem worth it as long as the cost isnt too crazy

[1998454]

You would need the complete engine. Your tbi motor does not have a crank sensor and it would be a pain to do an external mount cps. The vortec also has better heads, higher compression and a roller cam.
ill have to look into what vortec components i could put on my engine now, i dont know a whole lot about the vortec systems since ive always had tbi on both the suburbans ive had. I do like the simplicity of the tbi but if i could get a few more mpg and some more power out of going with vortec parts it would seem worth it as long as the cost isnt too crazy

[Nyle]

If you aren't worried about getting to highway speed in a hurry, the 6.5 would be the way to go in my opinion. I have owned mine for about 6 months and have no major complaints(just a few small things that would be expected out of a 15 year old diesel).

My 6.5 is housed in a 97 K3500 CCLB with 4.10 gears, 4" DiamondEye exhaust and 305/70R16 A/Ts, I have gotten upwards of 22 mpg on the highway and 14-17 around town. Not bad for a 7200# truck if you ask me.

[Chriscon7]

Diesel power magazine did a comparison test the 6.5 and the 454. Towing wise the 454 actually did much better than the diesel. I would definitely keep the classic big block

[BurbanAZ]

You would need the complete engine. Your tbi motor does not have a crank sensor and it would be a pain to do an external mount cps. The vortec also has better heads, higher compression and a roller cam.

The only problem is if im going to go through the hassle of a swap id rather work a little more and get a 6.5 and get the mileage also, plus with the vortec i think i would only get a few mpg gain over my tbi.


If you aren't worried about getting to highway speed in a hurry, the 6.5 would be the way to go in my opinion. I have owned mine for about 6 months and have no major complaints(just a few small things that would be expected out of a 15 year old diesel).

My 6.5 is housed in a 97 K3500 CCLB with 4.10 gears, 4" DiamondEye exhaust and 305/70R16 A/Ts, I have gotten upwards of 22 mpg on the highway and 14-17 around town. Not bad for a 7200# truck if you ask me.

Going fast is definitely not my goal lol, i want the tq and towing and reliability. I drive it so crazy slow now to try and get mpg i wouldnt even notice. There were trails that the only reason i made it was because i could put it in 4lo and just use low end tq to get where i needed to go, so i definitely dont want to lose that.


Diesel power magazine did a comparison test the 6.5 and the 454. Towing wise the 454 actually did much better than the diesel. I would definitely keep the classic big block

That doesnt actually surprise me that much the 454 has great power, ill have to look that up though id be interested to read that story.

[Nyle]

The only problem is if im going to go through the hassle of a swap id rather work a little more and get a 6.5 and get the mileage also, plus with the vortec i think i would only get a few mpg gain over my tbi.

The mpg gain would probably be minimal at best from a TBI to Vortec swap


Going fast is definitely not my goal lol, i want the tq and towing and reliability. I drive it so crazy slow now to try and get mpg i wouldnt even notice. There were trails that the only reason i made it was because i could put it in 4lo and just use low end tq to get where i needed to go, so i definitely dont want to lose that.

Don't worry about losing any low end torque by going with the 6.5. My brother sunk his 96 K1500 ECSB up to the frame in mud/snow about 2 weeks ago, I easily pulled him out in 4hi and barely hitting the throttle.

[helo]

454vortec would be approximately the same amount of work as a 6.5td (fuel system, new wiring harness, PCM). Probably better to go with your gut: 6.5TD.

That donor truck looks like a fair deal, but I bet he found a tranny or something. You'll probably want a new torque converter if you have high confidence in your 4l80e's current health. I'd recommend an ec3 converter from a '00-'02 3500 pickup/van. EC3 is ONLY available from GM (patented, the modern TCC will outlive your truck).


With a 350 he will not extend his fuel range by hundreds of miles...And going from a 454 to a 350 without sacrificing towing ability is hilarious...If that were true, the light duty trucks would have 454's and the heavier trucks would get a 350.

3500 pickups came with 350/4l80e/14ff through 2000 (vans through 2002). 350vortec+4l80e isn't a bad combo. :read:

With a 40 gallon tank and <10mpg running empty/clean, a 350+4l80e will yield HUNDREDS more miles per tank on hwy. I rock an '89 burb with 350vortec-tbi; I know my maximum range. :flipoff:

[Koots]

Diesel power magazine did a comparison test the 6.5 and the 454. Towing wise the 454 actually did much better than the diesel. I would definitely keep the classic big block

It was a stock Vortec. vs. a stock 6.5TD. The stock 6.5 is heavily restricted and a simple exhaust swap can put it near equal with your average 454 vortec.

Throw a new turbo on it, with a good IP, injectors, 4" exhaust and some other goodies. By the time you do all those mods you should be able to out tow your average 454. Once you get up in elevation, even at stock power levels and the naturally aspirated engine will lose.

If you got the cash, pick yourself up a nice engine from Ted's Trucks on Ebay. Theyve got tons of GEP optimizer blocks from a recent military repower project (using the P400 engines now, which are the ultimate). These blocks are stronger, have better metallurgy, come with anodized pistons (if it's a turbo model) stronger cranks, etc.

It's isn't unheard of to reliably throw 300HP at these blocks. Which isn't outside of the realm of possibility with the right part selections. So you can get D-max power for a fraction of the cost. I don't know how much they can go further than that before you reach the limitations of the IDI diesel design.

[1998454]

If cash isn't a concern throw some boost at the 454.

[Koots]

I'd hate to see the mileage after that though :lol:

This would equate to more power in every way, but even if i had lots of money I would hate to see it taken away so much at the pumps.

Mod for mod, you will get more performance out of a 454, but it doesn't mean it's going to out tow the 6.5TD. A healthy 6.5TD can tow just as good until you cross the 550TQ region.

As for what i mean by healthy, my 6.2 would drive as smooth as a diesel could, even idling like a pissed off big cube SBC. But it had nothing for power...but once i changed my injectors, i saw that the smooth, quiet idling was a result of weak injectors, the lack of power was from a worn out IP. It was funny because it would drive like it had no problems at all....You would think it came from the factory that way. Right before the trans died, the K5 had more off the line pop than my 2500HD w/LQ4 and 4.10 gears but the 2500HD would have it's brain for supper after 60MPH :lol: but that's about the same for any older smallblock compared to the LS-series.

Anyway, a stock 6.5 or 6.2 block has the potential to put out 450TQ with very few mods compared to a 454 but also getting better mileage. If i wanted a fire breathing tow beast that can pull a trailer until the frame is ripped apart...then i'd go for a boosted 454 with lots of goodies...or a cummins. But as a sensible towing machine that isn't far from stock and gets great mileage....the 6.5TD is the winner IMHO.

[1998454]

I wanted a diesel but when i finally found a truck i liked, it was a 454. Lots of power but it just can't pass up a gas station.

[Koots]

I wanted a diesel but when i finally found a truck i liked, it was a 454. Lots of power but it just can't pass up a gas station.

I must say the temptation to add a BBC into my K5 is strong...and build a 6.5 or 6.2TD DD truck out of a RCLB or ECSB 88-94 truck. I think i could get close to 20MPG with one tuned right.

[1998454]

I drove a 97 diesel and it had more than enough power to pull what i have. The 98 is an ecsb that the po had already put headers and a programmer on. Tough to beat the torque they make and thankfully I don't have to drive it alot at 12mpg!

[BurbanAZ]

I'd hate to see the mileage after that though :lol:

This would equate to more power in every way, but even if i had lots of money I would hate to see it taken away so much at the pumps.

Mod for mod, you will get more performance out of a 454, but it doesn't mean it's going to out tow the 6.5TD. A healthy 6.5TD can tow just as good until you cross the 550TQ region.

As for what i mean by healthy, my 6.2 would drive as smooth as a diesel could, even idling like a pissed off big cube SBC. But it had nothing for power...but once i changed my injectors, i saw that the smooth, quiet idling was a result of weak injectors, the lack of power was from a worn out IP. It was funny because it would drive like it had no problems at all....You would think it came from the factory that way. Right before the trans died, the K5 had more off the line pop than my 2500HD w/LQ4 and 4.10 gears but the 2500HD would have it's brain for supper after 60MPH :lol: but that's about the same for any older smallblock compared to the LS-series.

Anyway, a stock 6.5 or 6.2 block has the potential to put out 450TQ with very few mods compared to a 454 but also getting better mileage. If i wanted a fire breathing tow beast that can pull a trailer until the frame is ripped apart...then i'd go for a boosted 454 with lots of goodies...or a cummins. But as a sensible towing machine that isn't far from stock and gets great mileage....the 6.5TD is the winner IMHO.

Im pretty set on the 6.5 td it sounds like it has all the stuff i want. I dont want a crazy race machine i just want something thats reliable that gets decent mileage and can still pull if i want it too and have that low end torque. Im going to keep an eye out and if i can find one for a good price or in a vehicle that i can use as a donor that would be even better. They are harder to find in this area though so ill probably have to keep an eye out for a while.

[BurbanAZ]

id still rather have a 6.5 but there is a guy selling a 6.9 out of an 87 ford for 500 bucks but i could probably talk him down a little. I dont know anything really about this engine or if its even worth going to look at, what do u guys think?

[Koots]

They have their limitations including the fuel pump (same mechanical pumps as the 6.2/6.5) and they are accordingly heavy...but are a big, dependable engine.

They can make big power, but due to the IDI diesel design, it won't make power like the modern common rail/direct injection diesels.

It will be heavier than your current 454 and it might be a b!tch to make fit. Plus you would need special adaptors to make it fit. Either that or you run all Ford drivetrain and figure out the smaller details.

6.2 and 6.5 still have a lots of options that the 6.9/7.3's just don't have. They still have their own aftermarket, but they don't have brand new improved castings made for the US government (P400, and to a lesser degree, the Optimizer blocks). Which gives the enthusiast a whole plethora of brand new casting engines, better than they came when they were first being made.

You can't argue with that IMO.

I personally don't have much experience with them, this is just based on what i know of IDI diesels in general, the injection pumps and a little actual experience working on a few 6.9/7.3 myself.

[BurbanAZ]

thanks koots, sounds like ill keep looking for a 6.5. Ill see if the guy will sell it for like 200 bucks i may consider it then or try and buy it fairly cheap and sell and make a profito put towards the 6.5. I like the idea of getting to use my existing motor mount locations, and transmission so ill just keep looking for a 6.5 or 6.2.