Aluminum Heads

[PonyKiller87]

Ok, so I kind of stumbled upon this guy Skip White on Ebay.

Sells decent roating assemblies for about a grand... pretty good deal, and looks to be good parts.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/330542512093?ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1438.l2649 (this one is for a 2 piece rear seal, but he says they have the same setup for 1 piece, still waiting to see a price on it)

So then I start digging around his website and other ebay listings and find this

http://www.ebay.com/itm/BIG-BLOCK-BBC-CHEVY-OVAL-PORT-HEADS-ALUMINUM-ASSEMBLED-BBC-OVAL-272-/350524048244?pt=Motors_Car_Truck_Parts_Accessories&vxp=mtr&hash=item519cdc8374
Pro Comp Aluminum 300cc Oval port heads fully assembled with 2.25 / 1.88 Valves.... $874 shipped for the pair.
He also has similar ones that are rectangle port.

So I started doing a ton a reading, seems Pro Comp heads used to suck but people say they are getting better, but I can't find any real flow data on them. Considering pretty much any other aluminum BBC head is at least twice that cost its hard not to consider these for a build. Hell I think I would have a hard time having a set of stock iron heads ported and setup with bigger valves for that price.

Any thoughts?

[SUBURBIAN]

You get what you pay for. PCE parts from skip white or anyone else will teach you a lesson real quick. Valves, guides, seats, seals, & castings themselves can be waaayyyy off. By the time you buy them bare, have them looked over/repaired and assembled, you're right at what it would cost for a set of pro-filers.

I sure wouldn't want to cheap on parts only to drop a valve and ruin my engine. You'll pay a crapload more for the repairs than you would have spent on some proper heads in the first place.

[1998454]

The rotating assembly looks like all good stuff. I would love to build a 496 for my truck. I know a guy that runs pro comp heads on his 468 powered pull truck. He got the bare heads and had a shop install good hardware and has no issues. I don't know all the details of the engine, but he has a dyno sheet and a video at his house...made 620hp.

[mrhp]

^^^^^^ I totally agree with suburbian. Especially if you are building a performance motor. Hi horsepower=hi dollars.

[xch3no2]

Chad is a awesome head guy, he has some bargain stuff and great advice.

http://www.speierracingheads.com/

Darin Morgan is back with Reher Morrison, so his stuff is pretty pricey now.

http://www.rehermorrison.com/

[PonyKiller87]

Damn, even the bargain stuff on those sites is over $2g for a set of heads.

Thats my thing, I'm not building a drag car. I want a strong truck motor that will make some power. Most of the race heads wouldn't work well in a truck because I would have to bump the idle up and run a high stall converter, which doesn't really work well for my application.

I guess what I'm asking is are the Pro Comps going to be better than the stock vortec heads?

[SUBURBIAN]

No. They won't.

[gmcrox85]

You will lose compression with the pro comp heads but i believe you can angle mill them down 1.5 degrees to get some compression back. other then that they are a great head the set i got for a sbc a couple years ago had pretty crude castings on the intake and exhaust runners but it took no time to clean them up with a die grinder, they also take a longer head bolt and valve stem over factory bbc heads. I almost purchased a set for my 454 truck but decided to go with iron heads for that piece of mind and daily driver reliability.

[XLR8N]

Get some stock vortecs and have a good guy do a little work to them.

I guess you are building an engine for the truck in sig?

[1.721afr]

We are trying to steer you away from a product that has had a distinct rep for bad QC.

Again Pro-filer is a reasonable choice. Edlbrock's alum. BBC are OK but I think you could do better for the same money.
Consider AFR they are well respected, tho not the top dog some think they are.

[PonyKiller87]

Yes, this if for the truck in my sig, which I use to snow plow, pull a car trailer and would like to start doing truck pulls with it. Also at some point in time it will be getting turbo, not sure when but eventually.

I talked two 2 local places that are well known for head work and they both told me the same thing, for the money I would dump into having my stock vortec's worked up I should just go buy some aluminum heads.

Also I get that Pro Comp has a bad rep, but everything I read about thier BBC heads is old and is for a 320cc head. I found a few newer threads that seem to say that the 300cc BBC heads are a new design and much better quality than the old procomp stuff. I'm not saying I beleive it but for that much a price difference I'm willing to look into it a little more.

This place actually lists flow numbers on them http://www.kmjent.com/cart/product.php?productid=4517

This thread has some stock head flow info for the vortecs http://www.chevelles.com/forums/showthread.php?t=248642&highlight=l-29
This thread is the guys second pass at porting and they still don't come close to what the pro comps are advertised at. http://www.chevelles.com/forums/showthread.php?t=249093&highlight=l-29

[xch3no2]

I think if you get the heads from Skip your not likely to go wrong, he is well familiar with the past problems.

His reputation is solid.

[Miles B]

I went through this same decision a few months ago. I came out with Brodix heads. Don't get me wrong, I am a bargain hunter but I have been burned by chinese stuff too many times. It really isn't the same. The valves are of lesser quality. The guides. The seats. The springs. There is a place for cheap. If I was building a 4000 lb car to drive 2000 miles a year, I would consider those heads. But I will drive this truck every day. I am putting propane on it and a turbo, both of which are hard on valves and seats. So the extra $1000 makes sense to me. Same deal with the turbo. People get lucky with the $500 chinese ebay turbos. That's fine but I want to be sure. So I will spend an extra thousand or so on a better quality turbo. You do get what you pay for and cheaper quality stuff won't do for what I'm building.

Plus I try to buy American.

[SUBURBIAN]

I went through this same decision a few months ago. I came out with Brodix heads. Don't get me wrong, I am a bargain hunter but I have been burned by chinese stuff too many times. It really isn't the same. The valves are of lesser quality. The guides. The seats. The springs. There is a place for cheap. If I was building a 4000 lb car to drive 2000 miles a year, I would consider those heads. But I will drive this truck every day. I am putting propane on it and a turbo, both of which are hard on valves and seats. So the extra $1000 makes sense to me. Same deal with the turbo. People get lucky with the $500 chinese ebay turbos. That's fine but I want to be sure. So I will spend an extra thousand or so on a better quality turbo. You do get what you pay for and cheaper quality stuff won't do for what I'm building.

Plus I try to buy American.

Look at that. An Aussie with more Patriotism than some FSCers from the US of A.

[Mr Brown]

Reher-Morrison raptor heads make good power, we run a 588 with a set of them in the drag car I crew on, it makes a lil over 1k all motor. Not cheap, but proven performance.
On the other end of the spectrum I have a chinese turbo on my bike. I haven't had any issues from it, but I may just have had good luck.

[1998454]

Talk to bowtie44s he has a set of those procomp heads on his truck that came from skip. I think he's still working out the tune "tbi" but he said the heads looked great.

[Miles B]

Look at that. An Aussie with more Patriotism than some FSCers from the US of A.

Actually I was born in South Carolina.

[99urbansuburban]

I got a set of his SS roller rockers for the l-29, looks to be good quality, got them washed and oiled and installed. only time will tell, good price fast shipping.

[PonyKiller87]

Are those rockers really as huge as they look in his pictures or did he just have a 5 yr old kid holding them? lol. Any issues installing them? Are the supplied poly locks tall enough to run a stud girdle?

I was planning on doing a set of those and the Howards retro roller lifters all from Skip when I get too it, he has some great pricing.

[bowtie44s]

454 Pro Comp Heads
Hey one of the other guys in the Big Block section told me you recently built a 454 with a set of pro comp heads from Skip White.

I'm considering these heads also for my build but there is a ton of people out there that say they are junk, also seems to be alot of confusion between the old and new versions of the head.

Did you get the new 300cc version? any comments? the big thing most people seem to bitch about is the valve seats and guides. Got any pictures of the your build?

Also what headers are you running? Any clearance issues on the truck due to the raised exhaust ports on the head?

I have a set of Heddman 69398 Long Tubes that I am planning on using. They are only a 1 3/4 primary but they have a 3" collector. That was the biggest header I could find for a CK truck.

I have a thread called "Aluminum Heads" in the Big Block performance section, stop in and post up for all the **** talkers, lol.


I did buy a set of pro comp heads from skip white. I may be wrong, but from what I read, the pro comp electronics are made in china and are junk but the heads are made in USA. That's what I read somewhere maybe its not right. I got the 300cc 2.25 1.88 heads. The thing is I couldnt afford edelbrock or brodix heads but I could afford these, I was nervous myself. Apparantly skip white has a real good head man and he goes over them closely and puts in good valves and springs, read it on ebay. I didnt see ANY casting flaws, everything looked first class.

As far as the headers, I have the same hedmans you have. You need 2" primaries for these heads. Nobody makes 2" headers for these trucks except a set of almost $900 ceramic ones and I want to stay in the $200 range. Summit has tons of 2" primary 3.5" collector headers in that price range but I have no idea if they'll fit on my 88 k3500. I think i'm just going to order a set and see if they'll fit and if not send them back. My only other option would be to build a set.

[PonyKiller87]

I did buy a set of pro comp heads from skip white. I may be wrong, but from what I read, the pro comp electronics are made in china and are junk but the heads are made in USA. That's what I read somewhere maybe its not right. I got the 300cc 2.25 1.88 heads. The thing is I couldnt afford edelbrock or brodix heads but I could afford these, I was nervous myself. Apparantly skip white has a real good head man and he goes over them closely and puts in good valves and springs, read it on ebay. I didnt see ANY casting flaws, everything looked first class.

As far as the headers, I have the same hedmans you have. You need 2" primaries for these heads. Nobody makes 2" headers for these trucks except a set of almost $900 ceramic ones and I want to stay in the $200 range. Summit has tons of 2" primary 3.5" collector headers in that price range but I have no idea if they'll fit on my 88 k3500. I think i'm just going to order a set and see if they'll fit and if not send them back. My only other option would be to build a set.

Thanks for weighing in with some actual experience with these heads.

You should be able to run the headers that you have its just they are going to hold you back a little due to the size. Being that they have a pretty thick 3/8" flange at the head you might beable to chamfer the inside out to match the head. That would at least smooth the flow from the head into the pipe vs having a ledge there.

[Miles B]

but the heads are made in USA. That's what I read somewhere maybe its not right.
It's not. The casting are definitely Chinese. The best answer I could get (including out of pro comp) was "at least some of the machining and assembly is done in the USA".


Apparantly skip white has a real good head man and he goes over them closely and puts in good valves and springs, read it on ebay
I've bought stuff from Skip. He definitely does sell the best of the cheap stuff. I'm happy to buy again from him, and no doubt I will. I recently bought a set of his sheet metal valve covers for this truck. And I'm not trying to say that for $839 his heads are not a good deal. They are. If you want a cheap set of heads, they are great. But like I said, for this truck I did not. I have no doubt Skip does have a good head guy, and unlike a lot of sellers he probably does do a good job of sending back the garbage. Skip stocks cheap stuff but he does value his reputation. But there is just no way the parts that go in his heads are as good as the parts going in the high dollar heads. I used to want to believe it, but when you look at the cost of the seats I need to stand up to a hot, dry fuel like propane, and the cost of similar valves, they just can't be in the $839 heads. I was dubious that the Brodix at $1900 could even have the grade of hardware I wanted. I was prepared to buy them unassembled at $1200 and put another $2000 into hardware and machining but my head guy said somehow they manage to get the quality I need in there at $1900.

But again, I am aiming to run propane, a turbo, tow, and have a motor that goes for 120k miles between valve jobs.

[PonyKiller87]

I eventually plan on putting turbos on this truck, but it will most likely be intercooled and have water injection to keep things cool.

Unlike your truck, mine doesn't even see 5k miles a year, which is another reason I have a hard time justifying an extra 1-2 grand just for the heads.

Maybe some day if I start hitting bigger HP numbers I will have the heads rebuilt with better parts just for peice of mind.

[bowtie44s]

You should be able to run the headers that you have its just they are going to hold you back a little due to the size. Being that they have a pretty thick 3/8" flange at the head you might beable to chamfer the inside out to match the head. That would at least smooth the flow from the head into the pipe vs having a ledge there.

I am sure they're holding me back,no question about that. The problem is, the headers have a raised lip on the mating surface around the tube if that makes sense. The raised lip doesn't cover the corner of the ports so I keep blowing header gaskets.

I really haven't seen any problems with these heads. The machine work looks really good. I think they are worth the money. If I had the money I would have got the edelbrock or brodix because I'm sure they're better and the made in USA is a big deal to me, but I have less in the whole build than just a set of heads would have cost.

[PonyKiller87]

I am sure they're holding me back,no question about that. The problem is, the headers have a raised lip on the mating surface around the tube if that makes sense. The raised lip doesn't cover the corner of the ports so I keep blowing header gaskets.

Any decent Fab shop should be able to grind off some of that lip and weld a new bead on that is bigger so that they seal.

Worst case I guess would be to have the flange and about 1" of the primarys cut off, then have a new flange with 2" or 1 7/8" holes and reducers welded back on. Probably still alot cheaper than having completely custom headers built.

[1998454]

I'm sure you have access to a shop to fix the headers!!
I am sure they're holding me back,no question about that. The problem is, the headers have a raised lip on the mating surface around the tube if that makes sense. The raised lip doesn't cover the corner of the ports so I keep blowing header gaskets.

I really haven't seen any problems with these heads. The machine work looks really good. I think they are worth the money. If I had the money I would have got the edelbrock or brodix because I'm sure they're better and the made in USA is a big deal to me, but I have less in the whole build than just a set of heads would have cost.