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Dynamic EFI

This is a discussion on Dynamic EFI within the TBI Tuning (87-95 / OBD I) ECM/PCM forums, part of the Performance category; has anybody used the EBL Flash system for Dynamic EFI? someone recommended it in another thread. is it easy to ...

  1. #1
    Kickin it in the Bootheel Steveo87's Avatar
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    Dynamic EFI


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    has anybody used the EBL Flash system for Dynamic EFI? someone recommended it in another thread. is it easy to use? or is it even worth the money?

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    Re: Dynamic EFI

    Best thing I've bought for my truck. It is surprisingly easy to use. Truck runs great, options for a blower or nitrous or fans, etc,etc,etc
    Highly recommend for an engine swap, probably not needed for a stock truck. (my opinion)
    Works great either way, though.!!!
    Been using one for a year with hardly any issues. Great customer service/tech support too

    The EBL kinda smoothens out the learning curve for DIY tuning. Makes it easier to get going if you're new at this stuff..

    Don't get me wrong...Fast305 and some other guys are doing amazing things with stock computers and simple DIY tuning setups. The biggest thing is the knowledge base required to tune. Once you know what is supposed to happen, you know where to go in the computer to fix problems/make changes.

    Another reason I swapped to the EBL was that the '7747 computer sucks. slow, no options, nothing. Just straight speed density rich-as-hell TBI.
    What would be cool is to use a '7427 ecm and swap in a 4l60e. The '7427 is what came in the 93-95 trucks and seems to be pretty nice in terms of options and
    speed.
    Hopefully Fast305 or oldred95 or Haulin' will show up.
    Last edited by 91chevZ71; 11-07-2007 at 01:05 PM.
    91 K1500 ECSB
    LQ4/80E/241/60/14SF/4.88/38s
    98 2Dr Tahoe
    L31/0411/60E/241/4.10/285s
    EFILive

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    Kickin it in the Bootheel Steveo87's Avatar
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    Re: Dynamic EFI

    well the reason i ask is that my truck is going to need a rebuild soon. if i just do basically a stock rebuild on the motor with just minor stuff then i will just stick with the stock computer and order a chip. but i have been looking into a 383 or a nice 406 for it.if i went with either of those then i would spring for the EBL Flash.

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    Re: Dynamic EFI

    sounds like a good plan. A stock truck could see some nice benefits from self-tuning, also.
    91 K1500 ECSB
    LQ4/80E/241/60/14SF/4.88/38s
    98 2Dr Tahoe
    L31/0411/60E/241/4.10/285s
    EFILive

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    Kickin it in the Bootheel Steveo87's Avatar
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    Re: Dynamic EFI

    anyone else have experience with this system?

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    Re: Dynamic EFI

    Quote Originally Posted by Steveo87
    anyone else have experience with this system?
    I don't have the Flash EBL, but I have the original BETA unit that was pre-release. I am running the latest software with it though. Works well.
    1997 G1500 Cobra Conversion, 5.7, 4L80E, 3.73 14-bolt 9.5", L31 Marine Intake, CFM TB, 02 MAF, 0411, Custom cam. Doug Thorley Tri-Ys, full exhaust soon.

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    Re: Dynamic EFI

    I bought a EBL about two months ago and have been smiling since then. Every time i have had any question i got an answer that day. I am running a 4.3 v6 setup and have no issues and as soon as i get my motor together for my vortec i will be tuning again. Top notch stuff.

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    Needs project money chevyz71man's Avatar
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    Re: Dynamic EFI

    I have the EBL flash. Had one issue with it but it was taken care of very promptly. Sent out a new one with no deposit.. just on trust of me sending old one back. He is a great guy to deal with and his product gets better every day. I love mine and it will probably end up in a 3.1, 5 speed lumina one day to see what I can squeeze out of it for mileage.

    On another note with everything else that has been improving I would probably go to a 7427 pcm with maf. And tune with the ostrich from moates. Just because it would control my 4l60e, big downfall to the EBL. And MAF just drives so much smoother IMO. Also the 7427 is very easily converted to MPFI,(so is the EBL though) Fast runs it that way. And thats the route I plan to go for a cleaner look and better top end.
    Last edited by chevyz71man; 11-10-2007 at 01:20 AM.
    1994 ECSB SAS 7" lift, satin black h2 wheels, 36" IROKS, 98 Interior
    Built 383 and Built 4l60E
    2007 Yamaha midnight warrior

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    Re: Dynamic EFI

    I also want to do the 7427 MAF/4l60e thing. I think the EBL is as good as it gets for SD TBI/PFI. $.02
    91 K1500 ECSB
    LQ4/80E/241/60/14SF/4.88/38s
    98 2Dr Tahoe
    L31/0411/60E/241/4.10/285s
    EFILive

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    Re: Dynamic EFI

    Quote Originally Posted by 91chevZ71
    I also want to do the 7427 MAF/4l60e thing. I think the EBL is as good as it gets for SD TBI/PFI. $.02
    Get researching 7427 w/ MAF some more! I have a post on here back a page or two that really pretty much baby steps you through the whole material list with a ton of fricken info . . . . .

    It's called something like 16197427 w/ MAF Conversion How To on the second page of posts.

    I have tons more information, just a time to organize it all, and now that i'm laid off for the winter (my choice), i'm finally getting some time. PM me and i'll send you everything I have.
    1991 Chevy Silverado SBSC 4x4 - Built 305 .496 Lift Roller Cam Setup in restoration to be a DD.
    Soon to Have: PerformaBuilt 700r4, 33's, and a 3" Body.

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    Re: Dynamic EFI

    SOunds good, 1Bad. How about some stuff on getting IAT into the 7427 with the MAF? Actually, e-fans also.
    91 K1500 ECSB
    LQ4/80E/241/60/14SF/4.88/38s
    98 2Dr Tahoe
    L31/0411/60E/241/4.10/285s
    EFILive

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    Re: Dynamic EFI

    Quote Originally Posted by 91chevZ71
    SOunds good, 1Bad. How about some stuff on getting IAT into the 7427 with the MAF? Actually, e-fans also.
    Piece O' Cake.

    IAT Sensor: You can either run the Integrated IAT on the 5-pin MAF, or opt to install a separate one. Either way, the pin on the ECU is B9.

    Here is some copy and paste:
    - Hook up IAT Sensor: B9
    Here is what worked well for me. I run the bird-cage style sensor in the intake manifold vacuum fitting on my TBI 350. It has an almost instant response and seems to represent the conditions in the manifold the best. The cage style is not picking up the head of the manifold itself, but rather the temperature of the incoming air/fuel mixture.

    The MAT should be mounted as close to the inlet of the CAI as possible. This will report the incoming air temps. Youll then have to rework the MAT correction and MAT/CTS vs gms/sec airflow blending multipliers for the SD calcs so the correct fueling corrections are applied. The air density is estimated from both the IAT and CTS. At low flows, the CTS mostly reflects the incoming air temps as the air has time to warm in the plenum. At high airflows, the IAT will mostly reflect the air temp as the air is rushing in too quickly to have time to warm.


    - Also make sure your using a cage type. This has the sensing element freestanding in a cage, which insulates it from the heat of the engine compartment. There are several types of these. Im using the one for a late 90's truck (vortec?), which uses a simple rubber grommet rather then NPT threads. This makes it easier to mount in plastic


    "For the MAT and IAT, there isn't anything in the code to differentiate
    between them. Just the blend table to blend it with the CTS: IAT/CTS -
    Blend Filter

    Some folks have been successful with an IAT in the manifold with TBI.
    This is one of those things that need to be tried out. I tried it
    while using the same blend values as for an true IAT. That didn't work
    too well. I have a vacuum tap for the VRFPR in that manifold port, so
    I can't easily try it again.

    I'm thinking that with less of a blend range, more toward the CTS
    side, may work better."

    E-Fans: The EGR input is currently for an electric cool fan. I got tired of the stock fan switch so I put code in to control the fan to the set points I wanted.

    ALSO, all of this stuff is already enabled in code written by Dimented24x7 on ThirdGen. I have a copy of the ADX(ScannerPro) and XDF (TunerPro), so send me a PM if you want that stuff. (I know i'm being picky, but you and a select other few interested is all i'm willing to give the file to; the rest have to go directly to dimented).

    What else?

    - B
    Last edited by 1BadZ71Tahoe; 01-09-2008 at 07:27 AM.
    1991 Chevy Silverado SBSC 4x4 - Built 305 .496 Lift Roller Cam Setup in restoration to be a DD.
    Soon to Have: PerformaBuilt 700r4, 33's, and a 3" Body.

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    Re: Dynamic EFI

    Thanks! I'm planning on adding a MAT or IAT eventually. Do you think it will help my truck be more consistent at the track(bracket racing)?
    1993 S10, 355ci.V8, Edelbrock MPFI, 2" TB, 6395 ECM, $0D Mask, Comp 280H Magnum cam, Edelbrock Performer RPM heads, Lincoln Mark VIII e-fan, 4L60E, 8.8 rear, 8.80s @ 79 MPH (1/8 mile), and cost to much.

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    Re: Dynamic EFI

    Quote Originally Posted by V8S10
    Thanks! I'm planning on adding a MAT or IAT eventually. Do you think it will help my truck be more consistent at the track(bracket racing)?
    The primary function of a MAT/IAT IMHO is that it's another hint towards the whole engine equation if you will. It won't increase your horsepower to have one, rather you receive more feedback from the engines dynamics, which in turn allows you to tune your Fuel, Spark, and Air tables more accurately.

    - B
    1991 Chevy Silverado SBSC 4x4 - Built 305 .496 Lift Roller Cam Setup in restoration to be a DD.
    Soon to Have: PerformaBuilt 700r4, 33's, and a 3" Body.

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    Re: Dynamic EFI

    Quote Originally Posted by 1BadZ71Tahoe
    The primary function of a MAT/IAT IMHO is that it's another hint towards the whole engine equation if you will. It won't increase your horsepower to have one, rather you receive more feedback from the engines dynamics, which in turn allows you to tune your Fuel, Spark, and Air tables more accurately.

    - B
    better feedback = better tune =(predictable performance - denisity allitude)= predictable dial-in = more races won! Thanks
    1993 S10, 355ci.V8, Edelbrock MPFI, 2" TB, 6395 ECM, $0D Mask, Comp 280H Magnum cam, Edelbrock Performer RPM heads, Lincoln Mark VIII e-fan, 4L60E, 8.8 rear, 8.80s @ 79 MPH (1/8 mile), and cost to much.

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    Re: Dynamic EFI

    hell ya!!! the more sensors the better.
    91 K1500 ECSB
    LQ4/80E/241/60/14SF/4.88/38s
    98 2Dr Tahoe
    L31/0411/60E/241/4.10/285s
    EFILive

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    Re: Dynamic EFI

    So how would you compare the EBL against the Moates APU1?
    1995 Chevy Extended Cab 2wd: 14 FF, HSR 406, NV4500, Solid Front Axle

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    Re: Dynamic EFI

    Quote Originally Posted by chevyz71man
    I have the EBL flash. Had one issue with it but it was taken care of very promptly. Sent out a new one with no deposit.. just on trust of me sending old one back. He is a great guy to deal with and his product gets better every day. I love mine and it will probably end up in a 3.1, 5 speed lumina one day to see what I can squeeze out of it for mileage.

    On another note with everything else that has been improving I would probably go to a 7427 pcm with maf. And tune with the ostrich from moates. Just because it would control my 4l60e, big downfall to the EBL. And MAF just drives so much smoother IMO. Also the 7427 is very easily converted to MPFI,(so is the EBL though) Fast runs it that way. And thats the route I plan to go for a cleaner look and better top end.
    I've been doing some more reading and keep popping into the tuning forums to try to learn. I want to get into tuning, and the EBL set-up was sounding pretty good to me, but I'm unclear about what you were saying its downfall is. Are you saying it doesn't work with the 4l60-e? I'm looking to install on my '93 truck with Whipple and electric fans, and was interested for some of its boost friendly and electric fan friendly traits. Can you please clarify what point you were trying to make? Sorry if its obvious to others, but I'm trying to learn. Thanks
    .....born with gasoline in my veins and a steering wheel in my hand!

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    Re: Dynamic EFI

    yah, it can't run the electronic trannies. I hear that MAF system it pretty nice.
    I'm not sure how to run the 7427 on a boosted app, but there's gotta be a way to do it right.
    91 K1500 ECSB
    LQ4/80E/241/60/14SF/4.88/38s
    98 2Dr Tahoe
    L31/0411/60E/241/4.10/285s
    EFILive

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    fairly harmless Q-DawgVFR's Avatar
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    Re: Dynamic EFI

    I guess I'll just have to do it the hard way and learn with the rest of you guys.

    I thought perhaps I was catching a break and would be able to run that lovely program. It just sounds so user-friendly compared to the alternatives. yes it costs money, but if it saves me time and hair-pulling, it is worth it.

    What about a stand alone controller for the 4l60-E? Do they exist? Worth doing in order to run the Dynamic EFI?
    .....born with gasoline in my veins and a steering wheel in my hand!

 

 
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