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1997 silverado brake problems.

This is a discussion on 1997 silverado brake problems. within the Technical / Maintenance forums, part of the General Discussion category; Iv got a 97 Silverado K1500 4x4, 5.7L, Z-71. It had some problems when I got it. It started with ...

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    1997 silverado brake problems.


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    Iv got a 97 Silverado K1500 4x4, 5.7L, Z-71. It had some problems when I got it. It started with a rusted brake line going from front to rear. Replaced that. Did all the bleeding. Brakes didnt work. Noticed fluid squirting up inside the master cylinder reservoir towards the back. A mechanic told me it was the master cylinder. I replaced the Master went to bleed the brakes again and broke the bleed screws off the front capilers. replaced the front calipers and bleed all the brakes again.

    I still have a mushy brake padal and the brakes suck. The pedal is a little firm when vehicle is shut off. When it is started the pedal is all mush and doesnt hold the vehicle. I noticed that the reman master cylinder I got does the same fluid squirting thing inside the reservoir. Towards the back again. Could this master cylinder be bad also? Or is there some other problem? Thanks for the help.
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    Re: 1997 silverado brake problems.

    sounds to me like your brake booster is bad i would replace that and see what happens

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    Re: 1997 silverado brake problems.

    That's about all that is left. Anyone agree or think differently? Thanks.
    2000 Gmc Sierra Ext. Cab Z-71
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    Re: 1997 silverado brake problems.

    I see no reason for it to be your booster. From what you posted it seems to be working.
    To test booster- With the engine off pump the pedal till it firms up (This is normal),start the engine with your foot on the brake pedal. It should drop when the engine fires up.
    Was the new master bench bled? If not this may be the problem. Are you getting air at any of the 4 bleeder screws? If yes,you have more bleeding to do.
    It also could be your rear shoes are way far out of adjustment. Make sure you adjust up the rear shoes,if they are set too loose this can also make the pedal feel as if there is air in the system.
    Also the master may be bad right out of the box. I have had many new masters be junk right off the bat.
    HTH
    Last edited by 67DRAKE; 02-07-2011 at 12:18 PM.
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    Re: 1997 silverado brake problems.

    Quote Originally Posted by redlined67 View Post
    . Noticed fluid squirting up inside the master cylinder reservoir towards the back.
    Is fluid squirting OUT of the reservoir? The reservoir should be completely full of fluid and the top cap should be pressed down very firmly until it "snaps" into place. When you place the cap on and press down, a little fluid may be pressed out, but that's OK. The resulting closed system will keep any air from entering. If the cap is not pushed down all the way, or the fluid is not completely full, air could be sucked into the lines instead of fluid when using the brakes.

    Also, you may have mushy brakes after changing shoes/pads until the plungers get to their optimal position. Pump the brakes a few times to fix that.

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    Re: 1997 silverado brake problems.

    and did you insatall the calipers on the correct sides? bleeders at the top?
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    Re: 1997 silverado brake problems.

    Quote Originally Posted by redlined67 View Post
    Noticed fluid squirting up inside the master cylinder reservoir towards the back. A mechanic told me it was the master cylinder.

    ...

    I still have a mushy brake padal and the brakes suck. The pedal is a little firm when vehicle is shut off. When it is started the pedal is all mush and doesnt hold the vehicle. I noticed that the reman master cylinder I got does the same fluid squirting thing inside the reservoir. Towards the back again. Could this master cylinder be bad also? Or is there some other problem? Thanks for the help.
    The guy that told you the fluid squirting up in the reservoir = bad master cylinder, should quit calling himself a mechanic, or only offer advice on subjects he knows about - not brakes, clearly. When the fluid returns to the reservoir it will often do exactly what you're describing. This is normal. Not a symptom of a bad master cylinder, just a symptom of the fluid returning when you let your foot off the pedal!

    Quote Originally Posted by 1989cheyenne View Post
    sounds to me like your brake booster is bad i would replace that and see what happens
    No...

    Quote Originally Posted by 67DRAKE View Post
    I see no reason for it to be your booster. From what you posted it seems to be working.
    To test booster- With the engine off pump the pedal till it firms up (This is normal),start the engine with your foot on the brake pedal. It should drop when the engine fires up.
    Was the new master bench bled? If not this may be the problem. Are you getting air at any of the 4 bleeder screws? If yes,you have more bleeding to do.
    It also could be your rear shoes are way far out of adjustment. Make sure you adjust up the rear shoes,if they are set too loose this can also make the pedal feel as if there is air in the system.
    Also the master may be bad right out of the box. I have had many new masters be junk right off the bat.
    HTH
    Great advice - bench bleed master cylinder, be sure rear shoes are adjusted slightly snug (just -barely- dragging), don't get too confident that the new m/c is any good as it's fast becoming a "bad out of the box" type of part. However, your original m/c is likely just fine so if you hung onto that...

    Quote Originally Posted by slug View Post
    Is fluid squirting OUT of the reservoir? The reservoir should be completely full of fluid and the top cap should be pressed down very firmly until it "snaps" into place.
    Something tells me he's simply seeing this activity inside the reservoir, not with fluid escaping the cap, or with the cap off during bleeding.

    Here's the bottom line. The four wheel ABS units used from 1995-up on the pickups can be a real PITA to bleed 100% without using a scan tool to command the valves in the ABS unit. You likely still have air trapped in the system and without a pressure bleed or a scan tool, you may be fighting an uphill battle.

    Richard

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    Re: 1997 silverado brake problems.

    Thanks for the info. I'm posting from my phone so this might be short.

    Frist the fluid is squirting up in the master cylinder only when the brake pedal is being pressed down. Not when released. This squirting is making the brake fluid milky. (Fluid mixed with air.) And the reservoir is full and cover snapped on. The master c was also bench bled.

    The calipers are on correct. I know you guys have no idea who I am or my knowledge, but I'm not stupid.

    I bled a little over 2 quarts of brake fluid through the lines.

    I didn't check the rear brake adjustment. Ill check that this weekend. And as far as air trapped in the abs system, there is a good chance of that seeing the fluid is milky. Therefore it would be pumping air into the lines. I also talked to a guy with a similar problem. His abs sensors were corroded. Which opens the abs system. Checked/tested mine and no difference.

    Thanks.
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    Westin SS Nerf Bars, Putco SS Bed Rails, Truxedo Toneu Cover, Ventshades, Tear Away Tail Light Covers, Some Kind of Bug Shield.

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    Re: 1997 silverado brake problems.

    just today alone I got a bad master cylinder from NAPA, bought a NEW not REMAN and works good.
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    Re: 1997 silverado brake problems.

    Quote Originally Posted by redlined67 View Post
    Frist the fluid is squirting up in the master cylinder only when the brake pedal is being pressed down. Not when released. This squirting is making the brake fluid milky. (Fluid mixed with air.) And the reservoir is full and cover snapped on. The master c was also bench bled.
    OK, I'm hearing "possible bad master cylinder"

    Quote Originally Posted by redlined67 View Post
    The calipers are on correct. I know you guys have no idea who I am or my knowledge, but I'm not stupid.
    I don't think anybody was doubting you, but this kind of thing has happened quite a bit - hence why people would ask. Gotta cover all the bases when troubleshooting something weird.

    Quote Originally Posted by redlined67 View Post
    I didn't check the rear brake adjustment. Ill check that this weekend. And as far as air trapped in the abs system, there is a good chance of that seeing the fluid is milky. Therefore it would be pumping air into the lines. I also talked to a guy with a similar problem. His abs sensors were corroded. Which opens the abs system. Checked/tested mine and no difference.
    Checked/tested? What I'm saying is you need a scanner that can allow you to manipulate the ABS controller in order to fully bleed it. If you can't operate the valves in there for the purpose of bleeding, you'll have a very hard time getting the air out, regardless of how much fluid you put through the system.

    Quote Originally Posted by vic_V8 View Post
    just today alone I got a bad master cylinder from NAPA, bought a NEW not REMAN and works good.
    This is happening more and more often. Master cylinders and thermostats are getting pretty high on the list of "bad fresh out of the box."

    Richard

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    Re: 1997 silverado brake problems.

    my 1998 2wd did the same thing. Rear shoes were way out of adjustment. my rear brake line had also corroded.
    Last edited by a_tack; 02-10-2011 at 09:13 PM.
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    Re: 1997 silverado brake problems.

    Glad Richard chimed in. I was thinking air from ABS as I was reading down each post. That was where my problems were after brake job in the past. ABS is a PITA when it comes to stuff that was simple in the good old days!
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    Re: 1997 silverado brake problems.

    So will a power bleed tool get the air out of the ABS system or do you need to operate it with a scanner too?

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    Re: 1997 silverado brake problems.

    Quote Originally Posted by Broncofever View Post
    So will a power bleed tool get the air out of the ABS system or do you need to operate it with a scanner too?
    Beats me. I don't have factory service info for anything that new (mine cuts off at 1994 which still has bleeder screws on the old Kelsey-Hayes 4WAL unit, last year for that particular design, and was only used on the SUV's 1992-1994) - and you know the GM manual probably says, "Connect tool Kent-Moore #blah blah" because that's how all of their stuff reads, and the Chiltons/Haynes will say "bleed the brakes" and nothing more.

    Couldn't hurt to try, might be successful. One other piece of advice I've been sharing which was given to me by a pro mechanic that I trust - these modern aluminum master cylinders shouldn't be bottomed-out while pedal bleeding. Use a scrap block of wood to keep the pedal from hitting the floor. He says it's common for some designs to damage the seals if they go all the way to the floor. I've no proof of it but it sounds like good advice, and easy to follow.

    Richard

 

 

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