Got a few questions for the SQ guys.

[Gerald]

Im planning all the audio upgrades to my avy in the near future and need some help/advice as to what to do for the rear doors.

I'll be installing 6.5" CDT Eurosport components along with Image enhancement kit for the front. Components in stock location and IEK in the factory bose a-pillars.

-my question-

What to do for the rear? I've always been front stage only, untill the avy. Should I just go for 6.5" coaxals for rear fill with 1/2 the power of the front, or should I go quality components for the rear doors to match the sound of the front?

I'm undecided at this point. I do want to be HEARD, but I dunno If I need a full component set in the rear to keep up with the front.

Thanks guys!

[diehardgm]

If you are looking for SQ, go with the front stage only. If you are worried about the rear passengers not being able to hear it, you could run a set of coaxials off of low or deck power for rear fill. This is how I have my Tahoe set up. If you power the rears to be as loud as the fronts, I dont think it sounds as good. But, if you tone the rears down a little so that you cant hear them when the fronts are cranked up, it still allows the passengers in the rear seat to hear it, but it wont color your front stage.

[Exalted512]

Just a set of coaxials in the rear, powered off the deck. When the passengers arent in there, fade to the front.

A wise man once said, "I'll start worrying about rear fill for my passengers when they start paying for it."
-Cody

[BlackTahoe]

You could turn the rear doors into sub enclosures. It's alot of work, but where else do you have to put subs.

[Gerald]

I have my midgate walled off. Pretty much like a blow-through in a truck. Right now, Its 1 JL 12w7 ported to 32hrtz. I'm just not at the right ohm load to get the full potential outa that sub, being single 3ohms and all.

I'm thinking of replacing it with two L715s, sealed, run off a KX1200.1
Since the birth sheet reads 1500wrms at 1ohm, thats right at 750wrms to each sub, which should be plenty loud and deep.

I've had 1 L715 in a previous truck, sealed to a 3cu.ft. polyfill box and only 350wrms to it, and It sounded amazing! Deep as hell! So, thats what I'm after now.

[BlackTahoe]

well then, I wouldn't put anything back there. I don't drive the truck very often with people in the back seat, and if I do it's usually in-laws or my parents, who would rather do without. That might change this softball season, but I'll be running those CDT 2" tweeters, should pull the stage up so the people in the back will get better sound than having tweeters fire into their knees

[Gerald]

So, It sounds like I just need some 6.5" coaxals for the rear doors then. Just running them of the HU would be loud enough to keep up the Eurosports up front?

A JL 450/4 would be Ideal for this type of install, but I don't want to shell out the cash for it:crazy:

[///M5]

I would scrap the idea of the rear fill as well as the image enhancement tweeters. Neither are necessary and are a waste of budget, put that money into the install instead and make it right and it will sound way better.

[///M5]

Actually I'd scrap the idea of the CDT's altogether, the midbass is so weak there is no way to blend them nicely with a substage which will instantaneously kill any SQ install.

[Gerald]

I've had this set of Euroports and IE kit for a while in my yota, which I never drive, so I want them in the avy.

I love how they sound! I care a lil more about SQ than the average person, but I'm not a total SQ nut.

As far as their midbass, I sealed the doors of the yota, and isolated them from the metal with a mdf baffle, and those lil guys will drop some deep notes to be 6.5"s! I have them crossed at 80hrtz, and they will not distort when the HU is maxed. Of course the "could", but I don't crank the gains.

What do you mean by putting more money into the install to get them to sound better?

[Gerald]

And with a big 4 door truck, I've got to have rear fill. I ride passengers all the time, esp on the weekends.


I appreciate all of your advice and opinions, and look foward to more.
Given all the above, what would you suggest?

[BlackTahoe]

Maybe start with just the EU's up front first. Listen to them from the back seat, decide whether or not you need a rear set of speakers.

[///M5]

The CDT's do not have any authority on the low end, if you feel they do you should really try out something else and you will be shocked at how much better things can be.

As for the install statement if you need rear fill or imaging tweeters you have not done the right work with aiming, deadening, and adjusting levels and frequency response for the right imaging which is why I recommended spending the money on the install. I was also unaware that you had the CDT's already but either way imaging tweeters are a bandaid and shouldn't be used IMO. Of course as everyone on here knows I will say the same about rear fill.

[Gerald]

I see what your saying, but I'm not putting them in kicks. Since the front comps will be in the stock door locations, I feel that the IE tweeters are totally nessasary.

I guess like Blacktahoe said, I'll get the front setup like I want, and sit in the back and see how it sounds.

///M5, what 6.5" coaxials or mids would you suggest If I decieded to put them in the rear doors. To get as deep and low as you say. Has to be 4ohm and hold at least 100wrms.

Thanks for all the opinions and help guys!!

[fej]

If you must have rear fill (which I also do not like much, especially in a SQ focused system) I would run them off of the HU power and fade them out until you need them (IE passengers).

As for the front stage the "enhancement" tweets are basically bandaids to try and negate a poor install (which most factory locations deliver). They will help raise the stage, but if you don't have a proper install all you will have is your highs up on the dash and a poorly aimed midrange.

At some point however unless you are going all out with custom kick pods and door pods with proper aiming, you have to make some sacrifices. I mean it is a car/truck, and by no means a perfect environment.

You have a bunch of options, you could do factory locations with a nice set of components and improve the tonality of the system and its output, but not necessarily improve the stage/imaging.

You could do a 3 way front stage, with a midbass in the factory door location and a midrange/tweet in kickpanel pods (you could buy them from qlogic to keep it simple).

You could throw a 2 way setup in kickpanels.

You could make a custom mounting baffle that allows some aiming of the speakers in the factory locations to improve stage/imaging. This is probably the least intrusive install option.

In the hundreds of cars I have heard, and dozens of installs, and multiple world champ cars I have sat in, I can think of only one car that did "rear fill" well, and it was HIGH $$$$$. Was also a 5.1 setup for DVD/games focused install.

Good news is you have a lot of room to work with all depends on how you want to make it happen.

Fej

[///M5]

///M5, what 6.5" coaxials or mids would you suggest If I decieded to put them in the rear doors. To get as deep and low as you say. Has to be 4ohm and hold at least 100wrms.

I will repeat what you already knew I was going to say again. None. Rear fill is useless other than for ruining your sound stage.

[Gerald]

Thanks for all the replies guys! I've got alot to think about now.
As long as I can aim the components corretctly behind the door pannel, I'll prolly go that route. If it looks too tight, I might go with kick pannels.

Or, I like your idea "fej", of going components in kicks and midbass in the front door locations. That sounds like a really good idea. For this setup, I could use a good 4channel amp, right?

And it sounds like the best option to have HQ coaxials powered by the HU in the rear doors to be faded out whenever passengers arn't present.

[Gerald]

The only kick panels I could find were only for 5.25". I guess I could fiberglass my own then. I'd be cheaper than buying the Qlogic's anyway.

[fej]

If you can glass your own, by all means :) I know that q logic makes a 6.5"/tweet kick for these trucks now I have seen them. (ebay has em as well). To be honest if you plan to do kicks I would look at a 4" midrange/tweet combo in the kicks and a midbass of your choice. I would not go above a 5.25" midrange as they tend to run out of steam in the upper midrange area.

Couple install options for the 3 way:

Midbass in the door
Midrange in the door
Tweet on the A pillar

Midbass in the door
midrange in kicks
tweet in kicks

And like m5 has said, rear fill just pulls your soundstage rearward, and 99% of rear speakers are poorly aimed, and lower quality drivers which just makes things worse. Ask yourself this question, how many times have you turned around at a concert for that sweet "rear fill" effect? :rolleyes:

Fej

[Gerald]

Thanks for your help man! Sounds like you know your stuff too.

At this point, I've just got to sit in the truck for a while and figure out where I'd like all the placements to be. I'll return with new Ideas, lol.

[///M5]

I agree with fej, but will say that midbass in the door with the midrange and tweet in the kicks would be my choice. A 4" midrange is plenty to match with a 7" midbass.