View Full Version : How to burn Proms for TBI trucks


badburban
01-05-2003, 10:20 PM
For too long the practice of programming computer chips has remained a voodoo black magic art to many left only for the Tech Nerds and witch doctors. This has left many scared off by fuel injection as a viable performance induction system. Though with advances in technology equipment has become readily available to the public at affordable prices and many die hard enthusiasts have developed their own software programs to feed the need for speed of many speed freaks.

Equipment

The equipment needed to get into chip tuning is not very expensive. You need a computer, a programmer, light eraser (optional based on programmer choice), word editor, file definitions, scanning software, and a few spare chips. The total cost for all of this equipment, not including a computer, is usually about $300 or less. We will also discuss about cool toys/options such as emulators allowing for real time tuning.

Computer Chips

There are two different types of computer chips that can be used. The first is a standard chip, which uses a UV (ultra-violet) light to erase the information stored on it. The other type is a flash programmable chip. A flash programmable chip uses voltage to erase the information. The new information is basically written right over top of the old information. The 87-91 stuff uses a 2732 24 pin chips. I’m pretty sure the 92 stuff uses the same as well. But in 93 with the move to the electronic trans and gm moving to the memcal in the TBI trucks the chips went to a 27C512 28 pin chip. Know if you want the flash programmable version you are looking for a 27SF512. Also another thing is the chip speed which can vary from 250ns to 50 ns but it is commonly agreed that you can use just about any speed without problems. Though, I usually run a 90ns chip. There are chips which are called OTP’s. The OTP means One Time Programmable. Like the name says they are only programmable one time. You don’t want these.

Check out
www.jameco.com
www.digikey.com

Adapters

In applications with a memcal you will want an adapter so you can put your newly programmed chip in while still retaining the calpack on the memcal. You can use an adapter from a previous chip like jet or Hypertech or you can buy one from Craig Moates at www.moates.net Craig sells all kinds of equipment ranging from cables, emulators such as the AutoProm (More on that later), and chips etc. as well. Check his site out. You can also make your own using an old memcal and a zif socket. The memcal in 93-95 trucks has both the EPROM and calpack (the calpack contains the limp home mode information) in the memcal which is connected to the board via a dual row header connector.

A stock memcal looks like this

http://www.thirdgen.org/newdesign/tech/images/prom/1138118.jpg

A memcal with the cover removed

http://www.thirdgen.org/newdesign/tech/images/prom/1138119.jpg

A modified memcal with a ZIF (Zero Insertion Force) Socket

http://www.thirdgen.org/newdesign/tech/images/prom/1138094.jpg

A modded memcal with ZIF and a chip

http://www.thirdgen.org/newdesign/tech/images/prom/1138099.jpg

You can also use an adapter like a Hypertech or a jet. This is what I use because I bought a hyperjunk excuse me Hypertech back before I even knew I could do my own. Here’s what it looks like

http://www.thirdgen.org/newdesign/tech/images/prom/1138117.jpg

Programmer

The programmer is what “writes” the .bin (binary) file, or BIN for short, on the computer chips. When using standard erasable chips, any type of programmer can be used. If flash programmable chips are being used, a programmer that is capable of handling flash programmable chips is needed. Most programmers communicate via serial port so make sure that your computer supports this. Many guys use the Pocket Programmer 2 (PP2 for short) which can be found at www.xtronics.com

Pocket Programmer 2
Part # I-PP-2
Price 149.95
http://www.xtronics.com/memory/EPROM.htm

UV (Ultra Violet) Light Eraser

The light eraser is optional depending on which type of chip used. If a standard chip is used an UV (Ultra Violet) light eraser is necessary. The light eraser uses an ultraviolet light to erase any information programmed onto the chip. The light eraser usually takes 15-20 min to erase a chip depending on how many times it has been programmed and then erased. As they get older they take longer to erase. If a flash programmable chip is used, then a light eraser is not needed. I use the DataRase II

DataRase II
Part # ER2-ND
www.digikey.com

Word Editor

The word editor is used to read the BIN, which is the information on the computer chips that control engine management, and make modifications to the various values in the BIN. There are many different editors to choose from. Choosing one will depend on how much money you are willing to spend and how popular of an ECM (Engine Control Module) the vehicle has. Winbin is a very popular word editor. Winbin is free and that is part of the reason why it is so popular. It is a very good program, but file definitions are hard to find for it for some ECM types. There are only file definitions for roughly five of the most popular ECM. File definitions tell the word editor where to read the information from the computer chip. Tunercat is an excellent program that almost every programmer probably owns. Tunercat costs $80 for the editor and another $20 for each file definition. Tunercat comes with the $42 definition file. This definition file is for 87-92 TBI GM trucks. It is very easy to get file definitions for any GM ECM or Holden ECM. Tunercat has also introduced TunercatRT (RT meaning Real Time) which allows it to be used with an emulator for real time programming changes to be made. Another of the more popular editors is GMEPRO. GMEPRO costs $100 for the editor itself and another $30 for each file definition. Another program which is becoming quite popular in recent times is Tunerpro. This program not only changes bin files it can also datalog when used with the appropriate .ads file. TunerproRT has a built in scanning/datalogging feature since it was developed to be used with the AutoProm emulator (more on that later) so it can simultaneously edit bins and datalog (a BIG thanks to HaulinA$$ for all of that info) Check out http://tunerpro.markmansur.com/ for information on it. It is free but I highly recommend you donate $30 to register it.

Scanning Software

The scanning software reads the data stream from the ALDL (Assembly Line Data Link) port and displays the engine/power train information allowing the tuner to know what to change. The best part is that the scanning software can be found for free on the Internet. There are two different types of scanning software for the two different types of GM computer systems. The early 87-91 TBI (Throttle Body Injection) systems all have a 160 baud rate and for this you can us WinALDL. WinALDL can be downloaded for free from http://w1.601.telia.com/~u60113744/...ldl/winaldl.htm WinALDL was created by Jonas Bylund. I have not been able to get WinALDL to work on the later 92-95 TBI vehicles. I believe this is because the later ECM’s have an 8192 baud rate which is indicated by the fact the computer sends its information to pin M on the ALDL connector compared to the 87-91 which send to pin E. All TPI (Tuned Port Injection) systems have an 8192 baud rate. These systems can use software created by Craig Moates. It can be downloaded at no cost from www.moates.net Again another one to check out is the Tunerpro program. But when using this software make sure to donate money to these guys. They have invested all of their time and effort to create software which they have made free to everyone but would greatly appreciate any rewards for their efforts. Another great datalogging software package is also available. It is Datamaster and it is my datalogging software of choice. It’s a full blown professional package but at only $100 it is well worth it. More info can be found at http://www.ttspowersystems.com/diagnostic.htm

ALDL Cable

Both of these types of software need an ALDL cable to connect a computer to the ALDL port. There are two mainly different cables. There is a cable for 160 baud rate ECM’s and another for the 8192 baud rate. There are some schematics that show how to build an ALDL cable that will work with both types of ECM’s and this is the cable Ive built and use. The schematics for the cable I use can be found at
http://www.techedge.com.au/vehicle/aldl8192/8192hw.htm
The cables for the 160 baud rate ECM’s receive data from the computer through pin E while the 8192 baud rate ECM’s receive the data through pin M of the ALDL port.

Cool Toys/Equipment
Emulators

Emulators are a great tuning tool if you can afford one. The AutoProm made by Craig Moates is a great choice and allows for datalogging and programming modifications at the same time especially when used in conjunction with TunerProRT (RT being Real Time). The ability to change values in real time can also be a curse if it is not used properly. Remember if you have to drive do not try and tune at the same time. Let me repeat that. DO NOT TRY TO TUNE AND DRIVE AT THE SAME TIME. If you are doing this get someone who you trust to drive while you tune or vice versa. Another thing to remember is to go slow with changes and make abrupt changes.

What Changes Can Be Made?

There are many changes that can be made to an engine’s operating parameters in a computer chip. There is a full list of parameters that can be changed when using any of the definition files with Tunercat at http://www.tunercat.com/tnr_desc/do_tc.html

Getting Started

Many times the beginning tuner will want to dive right in and want to burn the perfect chip. This is not possible. The average tuner will burn anywhere between 10-200 chips in search of the “perfect” chip. I say “perfect” with quotes because this is really a mythical thing since you can never have a perfect chip as there is always something can be modified a little. But a good chip can be had quite easily and a great chip can be had with lots of time and effort. Quite often what happens is that the first time tuner will post a question similar to this:
What do I need to modify in the BIN for my 1994 C1500 with a TBI 383, with a Holley 2” TBI unit, with 90 lb injectors, Holley TBI intake, heavily ported and polished World Products Motown 220 heads, Comp cams 218/226 cam, 1 5/8” headers, dual exhaust, 160* stat, 4.10 gears, 2400 rpm stall, and a shift kit??!!??
If only it was that easy to tell someone what to do. When first starting out programming, the beginner tuner should start out very slowly. Begin with the easy stuff and slowly start to work into harder and harder tuning modifications like 3D tables. Most BIN’s can be broken into three elements that the tuner can change. These are flags, constants, and tables.
Flags are basically switches. They are either On or Off. Some examples are:
1. Enabling/Disabling Functions
2. Enabling/Disabling Diagnostics (EGR, VSS)
Constants are single values. The values remain constant no matter what the operating conditions. Some examples are:
1. Injector Flow Rate
2. Minimum Base Pulse Width (BPW) both Async and Sync
3. Fuel Cutoff speed (mph and rpm)
4. Torque Converter Lock and Unlock Speeds
Tables are sets of values that are relative to each other. There are two dimensional (2D) and three-dimensional tables. Some examples would be:
1. Target Idle vs. Coolant Temp. (2D)
2. Pump Shot vs. Differential TPS (2D)
3. Volumetric Efficiency (VE) vs. RPM vs. MAP (3D)
The tuner should start slowly with flags, once you have mastered that then move onto constants and then onto 2D tables. Finally after you have mastered these, then the tuner can move onto 3D tables. This allows you to become accustomed to your new software, equipment, your car, and what changes need to be made.
Now we can break down the radical combination suggested earlier into simpler questions the tuner should be asking himself.
1. I am using 90 lb injectors. What do I need to modify to compensate for the larger injectors?
2. Modifying the intake system with the Holley TBI unit, Holley TBI Intake, and heads will have what effect on the Volumetric Efficiency and airflow characteristics of the engine?
3. What am I seeing when using the scan tool? Is there any knock retard and what are the fuel trims (BLM and INT) at various conditions?
4. How does a bigger cam affect the fuel curve?
Some of these questions relate to actually changing the BIN while others relate to general engine theory. Being able to program a BIN requires a good knowledge of engine theory and a way to see how your engine is running. The truck is equipped with a Holley TBI intake, which does not have enough room to mount an EGR valve on it. The owner is probably getting a check engine light that indicates an EGR valve not functioning properly. I would suggest getting started by disabling the EGR function and then burning a new chip. Once you have burned the new chip, see if this fixes the check engine light. If it does you have successfully worked with flags.
The combination uses 90 lb per hour injectors on a 383. Since the 90 lb injectors are bigger than the stock 61 lb injectors and the cylinder volume (per cylinder) of the 383 is bigger that that of a 350. The tuner should then start modifying some of the constants such as the Injector Flow constant in order to work with the larger fuel injectors. He should also change the Cylinder Volume (per cylinder) to compensate for the larger cylinder volumes of a 383 over 350.
A reasonable place to begin with 2D tables for the above combination would be the Target Idle RPM vs. Coolant Temperature table. The cam is much bigger than stock and probably requires a higher idle. Unlike constants in which you only have to change one value in tables, you will have to change multiple values. There are different idle speed settings for different coolant temperatures.
I have only scratched the surface of possible modifications that can be made. The only person who can really decide what is right for their combination is the owner. Tim Siford from Thirdgen.org best stated the art of tuning when he said:
“Please note that everything you need regarding advanced techniques as they relate to BIN modification is not listed in an article for you to read anywhere on the internet. What you need to know cannot be found in some book that you can buy on Amazon.com. They exist in scattered articles, message board subjects, mailing list discussions, and old archives.”

For more info on tuning theory read my other tech article PROM Burning Theory 101 in which I get much more in depth on the actual tuning aspect and theory behind which modifications need made and where.

Good books to read are:
How to tune and modify Chevrolet Fuel Injection by Ben Watson

Other sites to check out are:
Thirdgen.org both the diy prom section of the message forum and the Programming PROM’s for your Thirdgen Fuel Injected F-Body: Part 1 Introduction located
HERE

Josh

*DISCLAIMER* The tuner is responsible for all damage incurred through their actions or inactions. I take no responsibility for any changes made, damage done, or for the accuracy of any information provided

91_bowtie
01-12-2003, 12:55 AM
Great job! :read:

I am still running the stock chip :eek: I know I need a custom chip but I really dont want to pay the 300 and still have to learn by trial and error what values should be changed.

badburban
01-12-2003, 09:50 AM
Thanks. Ive got a lot of time in it. This was originally for a paper I wrote and I thought alot of guys could use it. Really it is pretty easy If you understand engine theory. Some good stuff to read if you have the time is Robert Rauscher's papers. If you want maybe later on once I get some more tuning experience I might be able to try and help you out with a chip. I want to get some more experience before Id do anything for someone else though.

Josh

supermandan
01-12-2003, 02:59 PM
Way to go...Very cool article.

91_bowtie
01-12-2003, 10:51 PM
Originally posted by badburban
Some good stuff to read if you have the time is Robert Rauscher's papers. If you want maybe later on once I get some more tuning experience I might be able to try and help you out with a chip. I want to get some more experience before Id do anything for someone else though.

Thanks. I'll see what I can find.

Thanks for the offer. The main reason I don't have a custom burnt chip in it is because I think to do it properly, the tuner must have the truck in front of them on a dyno.

badburban
04-10-2003, 10:39 PM
Heres a bunch of links I have that you guys can probably use. Pretty soon Ill have some pics of my modified memcal with a zif socket in it.

Well here they are.

winbin file definitions and lots of other stuff

ftp://ftp.diy-efi.org/incoming/

thirdgen.org diy prom page

http://www.thirdgen.org/techbb2/forumdisplay.php?s=&forumid=16

thirdgen.org prom burning article

http://www.thirdgen.org/newdesign/tech/promintro.shtml

WinALDL (Application list, how to build a interface cable, etc)

http://w1.601.telia.com/~u60113744/software/winaldl/winaldl.htm


DIY EFI bins, and lots of other great things

ftp://ftp.diy-efi.org/pub/gmecm/

Craig Moates page (zif to ecm adapters, tpi scanning software, etc)

http://moates.net/gmecm/index.html

AKM cables(buy various interface cables and some scanning software w/ links to lots of other software)

http://www.akmcables.com/

ECM guide for gm cars

ftp://ftp.diy-efi.org/incoming/gmecmlist.html

Chevytalk efi forum

http://www.chevytalk.org/threads/postlist.php?Cat=&Board=UBB12

DIY EFI main page (links to lots of stuff)

http://www.diy-efi.org/diy_efi/

How GM EFI works (great explanation of most terms you'll need to know and some various links in the second link which are helpful)

http://www.customefis.com/GMEFI.html

http://www.customefis.com/index.html

Im sure there are more but I cant think of any more. If you have anymore to add add them.

Josh

Modes
05-06-2003, 11:46 AM
do you think that burning your own prom would be much harder if you had a superchareger amungst other mods like heads and intake?

adam

badburban
05-06-2003, 06:10 PM
Im not 100% sure on how they tune for a blown application. But here is my theory. Since a 2 bar map (or even a 3 bar map) is going to put out the same voltage range as the stock map except that instead of vacuum it reads boost. So I think youd need to delete every other column in the table then shift everything over and that would be for non boost situations and then youd fill in the rest of the table. though Im not sure on that. You could try thirdgen or diy-efi to see what they say. Im assuming you already have a chip to start from then. If so that would help alot because you can get a feel for what was done. If not I could definitely be done so long as you take thge time to educate yourself and dont mind spending some time tuning. Any other ?'s let me know

Josh

Modes
05-06-2003, 06:54 PM
I love tinkering with my truck, and after I massaged all other parts of my truck over and over...the engine is next on the list. I have decent mods to the engine already like my wipple, msd stuff, and e-fans, but Someday I would like to put an intake, vortec heads, and cam on. I do not want to get rid of the whipple just make it all that much better. Whipple gives you a chip to replace the fatory one, but they are setup to go on a stock motor. I know a bunch of burning will be necessary. I got the truck dynoed with air fuel readings, and the guys there said my air fuel curve was unreal. There wasn't a ripple in the thing just an everso slight dip down then back up. With the new mods I would expect to get back to that point through the proper settings on the chip. So I can read the settings off the new chip and go from there? This is not a near future install, but the research is. I read your tech article and will start with the links you provide. Thanx and expect more questions to come.

adam

badburban
05-06-2003, 07:20 PM
Adam,

Hey no worries about the ?'s. How do you think I learned. Im still learning. But having that whipple chip will make it much easiar on you. You can use that as a baseline and use it to see what they did. In fact if you do start burning chips and you copy that .bin file from the chip I wouldnt mind having a copy ;) So I can figure out how they did it so when I go to TT mine I'll know.

Josh

Modes
05-06-2003, 07:43 PM
will do. now just got to do some reading....at least the money to do it will accumulate. so much to read no time to buy and burn cash on other things. I was searching for stuff on bbc tbi and i came across the impalassforum.com, and their forum is the same format as this one. They also have an entire forum for pcm programming and engine management. fyi.

adam

badburban
05-06-2003, 08:02 PM
Would you happen to mean http://www.impalassforum.com/cgi-bin/ultimatebb.cgi Im a member there also. We're thinking about buying an Imp SS so I joined. Good place with some knowledgeable people. I also bought an LT1 intake complete from TB to Injectors, all roller cam stuff (roller lifters, spider plate, lifter guides, pushrods etc) for 140 :D Waiting on the guy to call and tell me how much shipping is gonna be.

Josh

Modes
05-06-2003, 08:14 PM
yeah thats the one. i love the 94-96 impalas. Was thinking about a caprice to mod...i actually fit in them, and the insurance company would choke me to death with bills if my car said ss on it from the factory. It would give sleeper a whole new meaning.

adam

Modes
05-07-2003, 08:27 PM
well i understand what you mean by your modified memcal with installed zif socket. I was thinking last night that i want to do this as soon as i can cause i have a couple constants that i need to change....i.e speed limiter or fuel cut off.

adam

Modes
05-08-2003, 05:18 PM
oh i understand. I read the thirdgen page....i know i have a memcal and was gonna ask you which meathod you used. I will go the same route most likely cause soemwhere i have a dynosoures chip kicking around, which is great cause it is a piggy back like the jet or whatever. Just got to find it. I am glad i have it cause I liked the way my truck shifted much better with the dynosource's "chip" much better compared to stock, and they turned off the speed limiter or at least raised it. So that will give me a great place to compare bins to get some of the things done that I want to right off. I have two memcals [stock and whipple] and that dynosources piggyback. When I get going I will gladly give you the bins to the two non stock proms.

Okay now a question. When you go with the piggy back...you can put a zif on the piggy back if it does not have one correct? And the second part is are you supposed to erase the the prom in the memcal when you run it attached to the piggyback[after you read the bin from it and save it on a computer of course]?

I am pretty excited about being able to do this.

adam

badburban
05-08-2003, 05:53 PM
Yea you can install a zif socket in place of the standard socket on the piggyback. I plan to do this soon. But for right now I just keep pulling the chips out of the socket on the piggyback. Just use a small screwdriver and gently pry them up and out of the socket. Try to pry evenly on each side otherwise you'll bend the pins on the chip. Pretty easy to do and Ive done it. The zif socket is nice because you dont have to worry about bending pins putting them in and removing them and with the standard socket over time it wears the pins on the chip thinner so they bend easiar. At least this is what ive heard from some guys but those chips also have had a thousand or more erase/burn cycles on them. Also when erasing chips dont erase them to long or it will destroy them. Ive been doing mine for 8 min. But Im gonna buy a new burner so I can do flash programmable chips. Plus the new burner will burn a chip in under a minute vs teh 8 it takes with my old school burner.

Josh

Modes
05-08-2003, 07:05 PM
i think i am going to get a pocket programmer. Reading the webpage on it you can do FLASH, UVEPROM, EEPROMs. The software is windows based and it has "very, very" fast program times, which could be 10 i guess, but i assume 1-2 would be more like it. Is this a good choice. The thirdgen guy seems pretty impressed with it. and for an editor i think i will go with tunercat

badburban
05-08-2003, 08:04 PM
I have tunercat and love it. The graphing feature is awesome and it helps me out alot especially making sure you dont have any holes in the fuel and spark tables. Ive heard alot of good things about the procket programmer. I dont have one but everyone says they are good. What year is your truck. You can download tunercat for free and use it for 30 days and if you have a 1227747 the download comes with the correct file definition. You can also download datamaster and use it for 20 runs for free. Datamaster :head: I really like it. You'll need an interface cable. If you want Ive got a schematic for the one i made i could send ya. It will do both 160 and 8192 baud ecms.

Josh

Modes
05-08-2003, 08:21 PM
I have a 95. I have a different ecm. I have a $0D 16196395 or
16197427 94 - 95 C/K Truck, Van, 4.3L, 5.7L & 7.4L according to tunercat. I have my factory memcal infront of me and the number on top of it is 16200094, if that is relative to anything i don't know

I was looking at this cable. Fully Assembled OBDI Cable w/OBDII Connector For OBDI cars with an OBDII connector
This is a fully assembled cable. Most '95 model cars have this configuration. It will plug directly into your OBDII style ALDL port, no soldering is required.
$ 65 Shipped to your door , but i will definitely take the schematic. I beleive I am 8192 baud rate.

I downloaded the scanning software from Craig Moates.

badburban
05-08-2003, 09:05 PM
Ive got a 94 and have the 16196935 with the $0D definition file also. On the top of the ecm next to the 16196935 should be a group of 4 letters (BLJF for example thats what mine is) and this will be the broadcast code which is what program you have on your chip. Moates has scanning software for us trucks now. I did not know this. Last time i looked which was a while ago he didnt have anythign for us. THough he said he was working on something. I did not know the 95's had the obd2 aldl port. Thats odd makes things a bit more interesting. $65 that aint bad. Does it have molded cable ends or is just a crimp on style connector which plugs into it. Im trying to see If i can find molded calbe ends cheap and if I can Ill start making them for you guys for cheap. The cheapest Ive found with molded cable ends is $100.

Modes
05-08-2003, 10:32 PM
the way i read the ad was that it had molded ends, but i did not understand how it was so cheap....this the the page i got it from

Ruse Electronics http://www.geocities.com/steve3034/cables.html

Suburbanite
07-04-2003, 01:38 PM
Is it really necessary to burn so many chips? I could've sworn that it was possible to run a vehicle from a 'chip' program on a portable computer (laptop, ... whatever), tweak the values as necessary & then once finalized burn the program to a chip. Am I thinking of a completely different application & way off in left field somewhere?

badburban
07-06-2003, 09:34 PM
Well no one made emulators for the slow computers these trucks have. Recently I ahve hear that tunercat had an emulator for the 1227730 and I knew a few guys on thirdgen who said they were beta testers. But I doubt that making an emulator for the tbi trucks is high on his list because not many people waste there time trying to build tbi performance motors. Now for some of the newer stuff this is possible but not us old school guys. We have to burn 1 chip at a time then test it make changes and burn another chip. Now if an emulator came out id buy it because it would make tuning idle tables oh so nice but Im not gonna tune WOT fuel and spark tables while driving. Shoot its hard enough to do control alt delete on start up and then type in my password while drving.

Josh

Suburbanite
07-08-2003, 08:20 PM
FWIW, had no intention of tuning while driving, just wanted to shortcut the process as much as possible but I guess that won't be happening (unless I get really ambitious ... NOT!).

Dang ... oh well ... I guess it's old school or no school.

HaulnA$$
07-29-2003, 01:04 AM
Great Tech Article :rocking:

badburban, I am in the process of building a 383 stroker similar to yours and I am also an electronics type, so I am into burning my own chips. Here is the setup I am working on and hope to finish within the next 3 months:

'94 Chev ECSB
383 Stroker
Scat 9000 cast steel crank
4340 Steel 5.7" rods
Kieth Black 18cc dish hyperutectic 9.7:1 pistons
Comp Cams roller cam 224/230 duration @.050 lift 503/510 lift
Trick Flow 64cc chamber aluminum heads w/195cc intake runners, 2.02/1.6 valves and 1.5 roller rockers
Weiand 7525 single plane carb intake w/EGR
Holley 900cfm 4BBL TBI w/my own design quad injector driver pcb
Hooker 1 3/4" long tube headers w/ 2 chamber flowmaster and hi-flow cat
etc., etc., etc.

To make a long story short, I am fairly comfortable with tuning my basiclly stock 305 right now, but I was wondering if you could send me a copy of your current .bin so I could get an idea of what changes I will need to make to the spark and fuel tables. Also any advice you may be able to throw my way would be much appreciated. E-mail me if you need any more info.

badburban
07-29-2003, 05:59 AM
Tongiht after I get hoem from work Ill emil you my current bin and tips.

Josh

cxpcman
07-30-2003, 10:35 AM
Hey badburban can you send me a copy of that email??? .. i'll apreciate it !! ..thnks

lykan
08-03-2003, 02:01 PM
Thanks for an excellent post, and answering the questions these guys have. I have no questoins..yet. But I have learned a lot from this thread, and enjoyed your responses and questions. Ill be stayen in tune.

I wonder how many others read posts like this gather tons of info, and never post. Probably in the hundreds heh

thanks again

badburban
08-03-2003, 02:34 PM
Originally posted by lykan
Thanks for an excellent post, and answering the questions these guys have. I have no questoins..yet. But I have learned a lot from this thread, and enjoyed your responses and questions. Ill be stayen in tune.

I wonder how many others read posts like this gather tons of info, and never post. Probably in the hundreds heh

thanks again

lykan

hey no worries. Thats the whole reason I wrote it. So people can learn what Ive learned. I started out not knowing a single thing about electronics and know I burn my own.


cxpcman

whats your email addy.

Josh

cxpcman
08-04-2003, 02:58 PM
cxpcman@yahoo.com thnks !

badburban
10-12-2004, 04:33 PM
My latest and greatest update version for your reading pleasure. I hope you all like it. I took a decent amount of time and redid it adding alot of info, rearranging, and modifying it.

Josh

some1else
10-12-2004, 07:34 PM
looks good!

JAYB1RD
10-13-2004, 06:19 PM
very nice, very very nice :cheer:

lots to read now, i'll be up all night :looking:

LOWGREEN1
10-28-2004, 09:32 PM
Can I use this stuff to troubleshoot my 95 350 5.7 engine. Also I checked the Moates site, Which programs do I need? This is where I was getting my info from, http://winaldl.joby.se/ but as badburban was saying I don't know if this will work on my truck.?? Also how would I hook this up to my laptop Dell 5150? I desperaly need this and any info would be great. EDIT:: Ok I found what I need to hook to my computer (USB To Serial RS232 DB9 Cable Adapter). Now with this thing running through my USB port will I still get all the infomation I need out of it?

Hardcore
05-31-2005, 02:58 AM
Very good info.

Mechanic
06-27-2005, 11:57 AM
When you modify an EFI controlled motor to increase performance without also adjusting the computer code controlling your EFI system, you simply toss away much of the increased performance that could have been achieved from your expensive engine modifications.

Some emulators are perfectly capable of working with the computers used in GM OBD-1 applications such as the 1227747, simply stack several of the smaller binary files into one larger file in order to achieve a size that the emulator is designed to work with.

Performance EFI tuning does not have to be expensive, eprom burners are available that cost less than $50, and if you are thinking of spending $100 just for software, perhaps you should check out this site (http://www.gmpcm.com) first.

GMPCM software includes full real time tuning features, and all of its definition files are free. It is the only software available that provides "complete" definitions for your OBD-I (pre-96') applications. GMPCM's $0D definition for example, has over 1000 areas of the code defined. It is a complete mapping of the binary code, and this complete mapping of the code enables you to optimize "any" aspect of your powertrains performance, not just the few limited areas that other software allows.

95Tahoe350
08-22-2005, 10:39 PM
I'm just a little bit confused. You refered to the 91-93 TBI trucks but did not say u could burn chips for the 95's. It is a TBI OBD1 truck. I thought i read they have an OBD2 port, is this true? I would just like a little bit of help, i would like to burn my own chips i just want to know its possible.

Red94Chev
04-06-2006, 07:24 PM
Here's a supplemental tech article from the TGO site: http://www.thirdgen.org/techboard/tbi/354409-come-free-tune.html. Very useful links!!

Geut
05-09-2006, 09:58 AM
Hello,

Is there a flash chip to replace the EPROM in my '90 TBI(1227747)?
I am making some mods on my engine and would like to burn a chip for it.

Thank's
Geut

HaulnA$$
05-09-2006, 06:05 PM
Hello,

Is there a flash chip to replace the EPROM in my '90 TBI(1227747)?
I am making some mods on my engine and would like to burn a chip for it.

Thank's
GeutYes, you can use the 29C256 or the 27SF512 but with either, an adapter is required as well as offset programming or .bin stacking. Check out moates.net , all the info and parts you need are there. HTH

Geut
05-17-2006, 02:49 PM
Thank's,

I have been reading a lot about the WB O2 sensor, but did not yet found an answer to my question !!!

Q : Can I connect a WB O2 sensor to the ECM instead of the stock O2 sensor ?

If yes, what type can I use ?

Thank's
Geut

bigburb
08-16-2006, 10:32 AM
ok i've decided to jump right into all this, i got my programmer, software, and cable, but I can't seem to find a datastream definition for my truck. all I can find one for is the 94-95 suburbans, not the 93. what do i do?

scartruck
11-10-2007, 07:19 PM
will this program my 07 GMC NBS truck, if anyone done it please let me know

Thanks in Advance.

91chevZ71
11-10-2007, 07:30 PM
this is for OBD-1 stuff, yours is OBD-2. custom mail order probably for you, my new truck having friend

scartruck
11-11-2007, 12:22 AM
this is for OBD-1 stuff, yours is OBD-2. custom mail order probably for you, my new truck having friend

Thanks 91chevZ71

I am looking to buy wait4me tuner, but same time I am looking for some solution that I can use with my laptop computer.

joe (scartruck)
Ontario
Canada

91chevZ71
11-11-2007, 12:25 AM
have you checked out the OBD-II tuning section? Could be something in there for the software/hardware needs. I'm pretty much an OBD-1 guy so I don't know the specifics.

90'rado
07-21-2008, 03:36 PM
Much thanks to all those who have put their effort into compiling this information! This information is absolutely invaluable. I called up Moates today and told him what I had (90 TBI) and that I was wanting to learn to burn my own chips. The equipment is in the mail! I can't wait to start tinkering with my truck's electronic brain for the sake of more grunt and possibly more mileage. I hope to pick the brains of all those who have gone before me in tuning, in order to learn yet more stuff about the truck I have worked so hard to build.